Tuesday, October 16, 2012
#1 - Themes, Ideas, and Messages
Give a major theme/idea/message of the film. Discuss what you think the film’s point was (in relation to this theme) – and then comment on whether or not you think Scripture agrees with the way the theme was presented. Employ at least 1 Bible verse to make your point. Remember to use the Scripture in context. Again, feel free to comment on and disagree with other peoples’ ideas; and if you see someone else use Scripture that you think is out of context, please look it up and report back on your findings. Feel free to explore other themes than the ones mentioned already.
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I think they main message in this movie is trust.
ReplyDeleteWhen the tribal people meet regular people, they thought of "spearing" them.
Ever since that Duymaya girl went missing from threatening attack, they have always been way to protective. The main character showed the tribal people that they can trust them. Sadly they still have a hard time trusting them.
In Psalms 25:2 it says,"O my God, in you I trust; let me not be put to shame; let not my enemies exult over me."
It shows that if you trust in God ten you should have no shame in trusting Him. :)
Wait - your whole post seemed to be about trusting people...then your verse had to do with trusting God. Try to tie in the verse more directly to your point that you're arguing.
DeleteI agree with you Mr. Talley. I actually think that the movie is more about trusting God than man. Like mainly by the wives of the men along with their children.
DeletePsalm 13:5
But I trust in your unfailing love; my heart rejoices in your salvation.
I agree. I think the main idea is trust too. But, what I am confused about, is how the Americans tried to show them trust, but they didn't quite understand.
DeleteYea the missionaries had to trust god. imagine being on an island in the middle of a tribe of Indians that speared almost anyone in sight and expect to tell them the gospel. They cant do it on there own power they have to trust God
Delete*then
ReplyDeleteBut what about trusting others (people)? Are we to do this? Is the movie suggesting that we should? Does God say we should/shouldn't?
ReplyDeleteI agree with Mr. Talley, the movie points out the fact that we should trust other people, but not in the way that we begin to worship them before God... In the bible, it points out multiple times how we should put our trust in God and lean not on our own understanding,or how we should have no other God's before him. I think that we should trust other people to the point of were we love them as God loves us, but not more than we love our own God
DeleteI agree as well. The thing about putting our trust in other people is that sometimes they can betray us. It's bad to put all your trust on a person that will eventually let you down. We are supposed to trust in God with all our heart, but unfortunatly sometimes this is extremely difficult because it's hard to rely on something that you can't see or feel, and it's sometimes hard to take the leap of faith. It's good to know that God will never betray our trust once you do though. He will never let you down.
DeleteCan you think of biblical examples of how/when people in the Bible let one another down?
DeleteLike we learned today in class, I'm sure Bathsheba's husband trusted David. What did David do? He sent him out to be murdered, and then took the man's wife. This is only one example.
DeleteThat's a great point Anna. David really let Uriah down!
DeleteMy name is Alyssa...
DeleteI think that the main theme in this movie is that in everything we do we should share the gospel/good news even if it means putting our lives on the line so other people can know the creator too. In the movie Steve's dad traveled to Equator to share with the indians that there is a better life that they can live and it's through the Lord, not killing each other. In the movie one of the Indians said something about killing makes us strong, and truthfully, putting this in a situation at Westminster, putting somebody down with words or physically, doesn't make us "stronger" because the Lord tells us not to murder and hating someone in our hearts and putting someone down is like murder. In the movie Steve's dad is murdered, and Steve in reaction to finding out that the man he had grown closer to speared his father, reacts in anger at first but then gives him MERCY! Steve realizes that nobody took his father's life, he gave it. If you think about it God did something similar. John 3:16 says, "For God loved the world so much that he gave his one and only son so that whoever believes in him may not perish, but have eternal life." This is another reason that Steve's dad went to Equator, so that these people may not perish but live with God in His kingdom forever in peace, and not in hell. This is why I think the main theme in this movie is sharing the gospel, even if it means death.
ReplyDeleteGREAT POINT TAYLOR! I agree that the missionaries had a strong passion for those natives to learn about God. But also, another point in this movie is to not seek revenge As Jesus said, " **** "and to forgive them instead of plotting, scheming, and annihilating competition. I've been a subject of this (not near so severely though) in the past, and it makes things much more complicated than just going to the person and settling things calmly.
DeleteWhoops! Getting a little off topic.
Anyways, those missionaries were put through great trials, and were eventually martyred because of the "trust issues."
I can get why people can be upset about such a serious issue about murdering a loved one, however, you can't search for straws to grasp at in a pile full of nails. Circumstantial evidence can be a real thorn in a reputation.
revenge. As Jesus said, "“You have heard that it was said, ‘An eye for an eye and a tooth for a tooth.’ 39 But I say to you, Do not resist the one who is evil. But if anyone slaps you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also." It is better to forgive them instead of plotting........
DeleteSorry, was "kicked out" of connect lab so I had no time to finish my post.
Woah, Val - never heard the straws/nails metaphor. Explain it to your peers.
DeleteOkay - in your post above Val, you've used this idea of turning the other cheek. Does God truly want us just keep being hit? Is there a time and place to stick up for ourselves or even to "hit" someone in return for what they have done to us? Is Jesus supporting that someone just be abused and misused and hurt by others?
First, the weird metaphor is kind of about not looking at circumstantial evidence and basing your point on something that may or may not be fact.
DeleteSecond, I don't think that God just wants us to be hit over and over, but we should try reasoning or another form of more peaceful way of settling things before you jump to violence. This movie is a lesson about not taking revenge. My point was that it isn't very biblical to take revenge out on someone without knowing what they are actually trying to do.
I agree with T.french. i think that the movie kinda says that we need lay our life down for the one who laid his down for us.
DeleteYea we take life for granted. WE dont want to work we dont want to go to school. But god is the one who gave up his life because of us. He is perfect and we are sinful yet hes the one who dies for us. WE should spend are life time telling people about him even though it may be dangerous.
DeleteI agree with both of you. I did some research and came across Proverbs 22:24-25 which states,
ReplyDelete"Do not make friends with a hot-tempered person,do not associate with one easily angered,or you may learn their ways and get yourself ensnared."
To me, I fell like the people on both sides were trying to be careful of what choice to make. The Indians,I feel, didn't know that their leader's heart was hardened. This verse implies with that situation because it was the Indian tribes choice whether or not to follow him, which he had major anger issues. The whole time, the American families stayed motivated and remembered that God is in control. One line said that really stuck out to me was when Steve's dad was leaving and Steve was scared the Indians were going to kill him: "Steve, I can die today because I know i will go to heaven. They can't." This quote left me thinking, wow. This family is clearly built on faith, and faith alone.
I agree with you Hannah. Great Point!
DeleteHannah that really is a great point, and i totally agree. I also see, thinking back to that scene, that Steve's dad didn't really seem scared to go, and he wasn't really afraid of dying. He knows that he'll go to heaven, and by going to these people, they may be able to go to heaven, too and know the God, creator of everything! Steve's family truly believed that God was the only god and He is the only way. I think faith could also be a theme, because Steve's family had to really keep faith in God because their lives were really shaky down in Equador. God never failed their family either. Everything has a purpose which leads into a brighter future for everybody. That may sound really cheerful because we do go through a lot of pain on Earth, but in the end we go to heaven, God's glorious kingdom.
DeleteAgain great points Hannah! :D
yeah - wasn't his quote about "going to heaven" something in relation to why they couldn't use their guns on the Waodani people because they weren't ready to die yet (given that they weren't saved)?
DeleteYes, answering Mr. Talley's question, Steve asked his dad if he would use his gun if he needed to. Steve's dad(I think his name was actually Nathan) just replied that he couldn't let the Indians die because they didn't know Jesus and he would rather physically die than see anyone of them eternally die.
DeleteI agree Hannah. That showed a lot to do Something like that because i just knew if i was their i would have shot them.
DeleteMr. Talley, I was wondering if maybe they didn't use their guns because of the physical battle of the Waodani not being ready to experience death in the "shooting" way (metal sticks which shoot pellets)?
DeleteAfter I watched this movie I got the impression that the theme was to believe in your heart and to that you should not seek revenge but forgive others. This I felt was a little bit insulting to the story of these missionaries because the film never mentioned anything about God, the Bible, or why they were wanting to get to the Waodani's hearts in the first place. They do speak about praying and hint heaven but this theme I pulled was not the right one for this movie, I thought. In John ch. 17, Jesus is praying to God in verse twenty three; "...May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me." We need to spread this good news about God which is what the mission group is doing (though communicated veaguely).(If you think I spelled VEAGUELY wrong please Reply).
ReplyDeleteOops! It's spelled VAGUELY not VEAGUELY.
DeleteI agree with Patrick... the whole idea, in my mind, is all about how we should forgive others even though they did wrong, because we do to..."you notice the speck in your neighbors eye, but not the plank in yours" (or however it goes). but the bible is constantly demanding our forgiveness of others, in Matthew 6:14, it says "For if you forgive men when they sin against you, your heavenly father will also forgive you. But if you do not forgiv men their sins, your father will not forgive you.
ReplyDeleteWhat's the context of either of the above verses? Can you help us understand the meaning by explaining the context any more?
DeleteAlso, I'm curious as to whether or not you all agree with Patch in that the movie gave a "vague" gospel message? Should it have been more "explicitly" Christian? Explain. And regardless of your answer, what might keep a film from explaining the gospel clearly (in terms of Jesus/sin/salvation/etc.)?
Sure Mr. Talley, i think that the meaning of the message is that we, as humans naturally do, care more about what mistakes others make and do not realize what WE have done. We notice others sins more easily because we are afraid to admit ours, we try to cover up our sins by putting others down.
DeleteI completely agree with Patrick. I thought that Forgiveness was the biggest theme of the movie. I feel that the movie showed that if you do not know how to forgive, and quick to get revenge, you will live a sinful and fruitless life. In Ephesians 4: 31-32 its says"Let all bitterness and wrath and anger and clamor and slander be put away from you. Be kind to one another, tenderhearted, forgiving one another, as God in Christ forgave you." I think that verse does a good job telling us how we should act towards each other. We should forgive just like the foreigners forgave the indians for killing their innocent husbands.
ReplyDeleteRealistically, do you all see any examples of people in Westminster being truly tenderhearted? What does that mean? What does it look like? Have you seen any "real" forgiveness in our community? In your homes? What does it look like?
DeleteMr. Talley, I see sometimes see people give a spot at lunch to people they don’t really know(yes i really do see that). I think that being tenderhearted means that you show people mercy, even when you don’t think they deserve it. I also think being tenderhearted benefits In Proverbs 11: 17 it says, “A man who is kind benefust himself, but a cruel man hurts himself.” I think that all of us can benefit from being kind towards others. At home, my entire family often makes mistakes (especially me) and we always are quick to forgive. We don’t hold grudges against one another, but if we do we talk about it. We usually try to work things out
DeleteJeremiah 20:10 says, "For I hear many whispering. Terror is on every side! 'Denounce him! Let us denounce him!' say all my close friends, watching for my fall. 'Perhaps he will be deceived; then we can overcome him and take our revenge on him.'" This to me was the tribal philosophy
ReplyDeleteWoah. Context and meaning please. Then explain its connection/application to tribal philosophy. Thank you. :)
DeleteSo this passage talks about How God is going defeat Judah. His going to tear apart his city. In my opinion the leader of the woadoni people set out to seek revenge.I'm not saying God was seeking revenge but to my it relates how he want to destroy evil. The woadoni leader also wanted to destroy"evil". But he thought everything was evil.
DeleteThis comment has been removed by the author.
ReplyDeleteThe message or main idea of this movie to me was that these foreigners(missionaries)wanted to teach the Wadani tribe that there was so much more to life then having revenge on others, not all foreighners are cannibles,and that there was a real God out looking over them.
ReplyDeleteTrue, there was a God looking out after them, but how would the Wadani tribe know if they were there to be a threat or to really help them in some way? And even if they were there to help them they couldnt communicate with the Indians so all the Wadanis saw of the foreigners was danger.
Deleteya I definitely see what Amanda is saying. I didn't even know that the whole point of the foreigners going to the Waodanis was to bring them to christ. Since they don't speak their language how would the foreigners be able to communicate with them? How were the indians supposed to know they were not a threat? Shouldn't they have had a better plan?
DeleteKnow that I think about it you guys are right, if the foreigners didnt speak their language how where thet to communicate the gospel with them? So what were they really trying to do by going and living with them, make peace?
DeleteYea, know that i think about it you guys make a lot of since. Why were they trying to to communicate and share the good new if they couldn't even speak their language. I just think its weird that they couldn't even communicate with them but they were trying to share with them that the girl was still alive.
DeleteI think that the main idea of this is movie trust. I agree with Taylor. I think that we should try to spread the Gospel in as many ways as we can. But I also agree with Julie, in that wouldn't the Waodani people would think that the foreigners could be saying hurtful things and take it as a threat. I think it would be very hard to teach someone about God without being able to speak their language.
ReplyDeleteI think that the main idea of this is movie trust. I agree with Taylor. I think that we should try to spread the Gospel in as many ways as we can. But I also agree with Julie, in that wouldn't the Waodani people would think that the foreigners could be saying hurtful things and take it as a threat. I think it would be very hard to teach someone about God without being able to speak their language.
ReplyDeleteThere was a problem with communication here in the scene with the missionaries. they had no idea what was coming for them, but it was also good to hear that the missionaries last words were "I am your friend"
DeleteHow are those dying words similar to any of Jesus's dying words? What are so difficult about these types of words in our own lives? What keeps us from being good toward those who bring us harm?
DeleteI think what keeps us from being good to those that bring us harm is that we are afraid we might get hurt.
Deleteright before jesus died, he said "father forgive them, for they know not what they have done" Jesus didn't want any punishment on the people who persecuted him. He forgave them right away. It's extremely hard for me to forgive someone who says something bad about you, but we should try to be more christ like and forgive them.
Delete"For I know the plans I have for you declares the Lord, plans for welfare and not for evil, to give you a future and a hope." -Jeremiah 29:11
ReplyDeleteOne theme/message this movie portrayed was probably faith and trust. As the people were going to Ecuador they knew there would be some sort of difficulties there. In jeremiah 29 it's about Jeremiah's letter to the exiles nebuchadnezzar had in babylon. Just as some of Jeremiah's people were going to Babylon they figured there would be some sort of difficulty. Even though they knew this they still trusted in the Lord and had faithin Him. The people going to Ecuador after their loved ones had died trusted that the Lord brought them there for a reason and the woman didn't let their own thoughts overpower their strength in the Lord.
Maddie, that is a really great point. The people going to Ecuador must of really had great faith in God and knew that he was going to take care of them no matter what challenges or obstacles they faced along their way. I also think that they probably had some doubts and worries about going on this journey but having great faith is the most important thing that they could possibly take with them and use there to teach the Wadani tribe.
DeleteYes Maddie, that is a really good point that I would have never gotten out of the film. God always has a plan for us, and now that I go back and play scenes from the move and I see how God is working in Ecuadorians's lives. How He is sending people into the Wadoni peoples lives, which all comes back around to my comment earlier, on how God puts people in our lives for a reason.
DeleteAnonymous - please identify yourself - repost the comments with your name. Thanks
DeleteI agree with what Amanda and Julie are trying to say. What I think the movie was trying to portray to the audience is that God putts people in your life for a reason, whether we know it or not. I can really relate to how the Wadoni tribe was feeling when people they didn't know showed up, because a lot of times I feel the same way about people I don't know. I see them as a threat towards my relationships with others and my 'reputation', when really God has a plan. no one has to worry about reputations or popularity, because God loves us and sent others into our life with a purpose, not a threat.
ReplyDeletei think the main theme of this movie is redemption. As we see the Indians kill all the missionaries and the wives forgive the Indians and help them.
ReplyDeleteMr. Scott's Bible Class is finished with the project.
ReplyDeleteWeston, I think the word your looking for is forgiveness not redemption. Redemption, is the action of saving or being saved from sin, error, or evil: (God's plans for the redemption of his world.) When you are saying it is forgiveness. Forgiveness is the action or process of forgiving or being forgiven: (she is quick to ask forgiveness when she has overstepped the line.) If that makes sense? I think if you just switched those words around than your comment would be spot on! I think redemption and forgiveness are two very different words. And they can sometimes be taken out of context.
ReplyDeleteWhat is the relationship between forgiveness and redemption? How does Scripture use these together?
Deletei saw the whole forgiveness thing with the wives of the men who died came to ecaudor and communicated with the Indians and the Waodini people were eventually open to communicating and listening to the american people. Throughout the movie forgiveness was shown because of that and forgiveness means to have mercy on someone and "clean the slate" which is what we saw with the indian people and americans.
ReplyDeleteI agree with you Maddie,
DeleteThey certainly used both concepts of forgiveness and redemption.
They forgave the Waodini for killing their husbands and plus they helped the Waodini people save their tribe from being extinct. In my opinion, I call that redemption.
the film’s point was (in relation to this theme) was the transformation in the Indians. How their hearts changed as different people where placed in their lives. I do think Scripture agrees with the way the theme was presented. A bible verse that backs the message up is Romans 12:2. "And be not conformed to this world: but be ye transformed by the renewing of your mind, that ye may prove what [is] that good, and acceptable, and perfect, will of God."
ReplyDelete